Collective Muslim Responsibility

Lionel tells it how it is-

View on YouTube

For too long Muslim communities in Western countries have been enjoying the collective benefits of living in relatively wealthy, free and accepting (unlike their own) societies. But after these repeated and seemingly unending terrorist attacks committed in the name of Allah, it is clear that these Muslim communities and, in particular, their leaders have not borne their collective responsibilities. Time's up!

Time to get active to eradicate this menace. Within your "religion of peace" communities, you have all the information you need.

For too long the leaders of Western countries have orchestrated the mass and indiscriminate immigration of people from these Muslim countries and held back any accountability towards them. Time's up for you, too!

It's time for you politicians to cease this treason of yours and eradicate this terrorist menace that you fund and facilitate. Your governments have access to all the information and resources you need. Just ask Edward Snowden.


An internet friend has reminded me to say something that is in the realm of the bleeding obvious. Except what is the bleeding obvious to some is not obvious to others.

The terrorists and the Muslim leaders together with the media and politicians who run interference for them are all patsies in the end. They are patsies for those who are attempting to bring about 'the clash of civilizations' that will destroy western culture and the resistance to those that would make their rule complete.

Michael Collins was successful because he took the 'in-betweens', the middle men, the enablers, out of contention. They are the weakest link. By doing so he nullified State Terror. All terror is state sponsored. We need to know the game that is being played. It is always the same game.


Are you trying to say

Are you trying to say something without saying it, James? Just spit it out.


I don't like to embarrass people, anonymous. Even anons have feelings, after all.


I'm sorry, James, but I can't say I agree with either you or Lionel on this point.

He speaks very well, and he is far smarter (and better informed) than "the average bear" ... but he seems utterly lost with respect to two questions which (as I see it) are absolutely vital.

First, he speaks as if the common people and the political elite were one and the same; he says "we" did this, or "we" should do that, without ever recognizing that "we" -- that is to say: the common people and the political elite -- are two distinct groups, pulling in opposite directions most of the time.

Second, he misses another crucial point: moderate Muslims can't very well work with "the authorities" to combat Muslim extremism, because "the authorities" are fomenting Muslim extremism.

Other than that, I agree, I guess ... I mean, "we" really should stop funding ISIS, and "we" really should stop supporting all the other terrorist groups that "we" support, and "we" really should stop trying to entrap Muslim knuckleheads in bogus "terror plots" which "we" can then foil, to "our" political advantage ... and while we're at it, "we" really should stop bombing innocent civilians and invading foreign countries and overthrowing democratically elected governments ...

... except that I don't really mean any of this as I have stated it, because I have never done any of these things. Never. I have never supported any of these actions. Ever.

That is to say: I am not part of the "we" that does these things. But what am I gonna do? Am I gonna work with "the authorities" to try to get "us" to stop?


In my view, the truly moderate Muslims are in a very similar situation.

I am reminded of the case of Shahed "Malik" Hussain, the FBI informant who entrapped James Comitie and three others in a so-called "terror plot" in NYC and NJ.

In the buildup to the "plot", Malik had made himself conspicuous, hanging around mosques and clearly up to no good. At the mosque where he found Cromitie, the imam had noticed him but had not reported him. After the "plotters" were busted, this imam was asked why he hadn't called the police to tell them about Malik. And the imam said, "Because it was so obvious that Malik was with the police."

I could go on and on, but the point is, I don't think Lionel understands what he's talking about -- at least in this particular video.

Of Snakes, Grass and Kumbaya

Lionel's second name is "hyperbole" and though I usually think he has very valid points, I very often lose patience with him when he takes 20 minutes (as in this case) to say something that 3 or 4 minutes would have been ample time.

The fact is that he made a point (or two) that had been bugging me for quite some time and that is that the Muslim leaders were apparently sitting back rather than being proactive within their communities. And they are communities because they are centered around mosques and imams. Our general populations in the west are not communities in this sense and they certainly do not have effective local leaders. So I agree entirely about your point of "I" and "we" but I don't think it applies in quite the same way to Muslim communities.

The second point was that these Muslim communities are going to receive retaliation sooner or later for not doing anything about their co-religionists. What Lionel doesn't understand (at least from what he said) is that this is the whole point of the "authorities" sponsoring the terrorism and then holding back any reasonable response until the response that eventually comes sets off massive inter-communal violence. 'The Clash of Civilisations will be coming to a suburb near you' soon enough . . . sort of thing.

My point is that the Muslim communities, led by their imams, need to protect themselves by ceasing to be the 'grass' that the 'snakes' are hiding in -both the low IQ jihadis and the people within their own flocks that are guiding these loonies. They need to 'out' the 'authorities' just as much, too, rather than 'co-operating' with them which is your point and I agree entirely.

So to take your example, WP, of the imam involved with the Malik episode, if I were the imam concerned, I hope I would have the foresight and fortitude to speak to Malik and then announce to the congregation what I thought Malik and the 'authorities' were up to and to publicly expose the whole plot; expose the real danger to them and others.

It is these Muslim communities that are going to get caught in the middle of a shit-storm if they don't get off their collective arses and do something within their own communities now rather than offering 'tea and sympathy' for the victims and saying 'we are victims, too'! 'Let's all hold hands together while we wait for the next bombing'!

So Lionel didn't really make that point clear and he may not even see it quite like that, anyway. I do, though perhaps I did not make that very clear in my too brief comments.

we agree on a lot

... and I am also frustrated with the lack of action by the Muslim leadership (especially in US and UK but elsewhere too). (I could go into great detail on this point but I haven't the time or energy, sadly.)

My main point, which Lionel does not appear to get, is that the Muslim leadership can't count on the authorities to help them, because the authorities are targeting them.

I think it would be great if an imam were to do what you suggest ... I think it would be even better if they ALL did what you suggest ... but I see a lot of deer-in-the-headlights. They're trapped -- and it's tough enough just being a Muslim, or just being a conspiracy theorist, without being a Muslim conspiracy theorist. So I understand why so few Muslims want to go that route, even though it is the only route to truth, and therefore justice.

There's also a lot more going on, and we don't even know half of it. So maybe I should go back to keeping my opinions to myself! Wink (I don't think Lionel's ever had that thought!)

"My main point, which Lionel

"My main point, which Lionel does not appear to get, is that the Muslim leadership can't count on the authorities to help them, because the authorities are targeting them."

I agree. You make a crucial point about the duplicity and complicity of the 'authorities' and it would seem that Lionel doesn't 'get' that. I should have highlighted that in my original post and thanks for bringing it up because it is a crucial consideration for any remedy. Cheers smiling

Post new comment

The content of this field is kept private and will not be shown publicly.
By submitting this form, you accept the Mollom privacy policy.